Talk:Index fund

Suggest removing How to ... section

To me the "how-to" section is out of place in this article, we strive to present the knowledge on the subject, it should be left up to the reader how to use the information. That keeps us closer to Wikipedia's content policies. --Peculiar Investor 19:45, 22 January 2015 (MST)

We have something like this for ETFs already: How to choose ETFs for index investors. There is also something similar being planned in the "indexing" page: Considerations when choosing an indexing product. --Quebec 20:29, 22 January 2015 (MST)

I see your point. The nuance might be wording choice, to me "how to" is different than "considerations when". One is more directing, the other is asking me to think about something. Allow me to digress a bit, perhaps to give insight into my line of thinking.

Adding new editors such as yourself is bringing new viewpoints and makes me read things with a bit sharper eye and think about what is being said. That's a good thing. It contributes to the improvement of finiki as we all collaborate. On one hand we all try to following the standards set by other articles, on the other hand, perhaps we need to be questioning the existing articles in cases like this. There are many finiki articles that we written long ago when the goal was purely about creating pages and filling them with content. Quantity not quality was the order of the day. Editorial guidelines were not important. But finiki, and the editing crew have matured and the approach has matured also. This sharper eye also has me consulting and reading more of Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, to figure out how to handle the "issues" that I see. finiki's approach has always been to follow the spirit, not the letter, of what Wikipedia says. After all, they're an encyclopedia, we're not.

At the end of the day, all of the above is why I'm discussing this on the Talk page rather than just editing. Hope this helps. --Peculiar Investor 20:57, 22 January 2015 (MST)

I don't have your eye for such nuances! To me the goal of a "how to" section is the same as the goal of a "considerations when" section. If you look at the ETF example, you will see sentences containing "another aspect to examine...", or "additional criteria are...". These sentences could belong to a "considerations when" section...

"questioning the existing articles in cases like this" - well, in the ETF case, I wrote the "how to" section, so I'm not questioning myself... :-) With 300+ ETFs on the TSX now, I think a short section on how to select them is needed (it's a jungle out there!). There are fewer index mutual funds, but if someone is buying them in a mutual funds account, then the "whole family" of index funds from a single provider has to be considered (whereas in a brokerage account you can buy your funds/ETFs from multiple providers). For index mutual funds, I think 4-5 lines of text should do it:

- Choose your detailed AA before you look at specific investment vehicles

- avoid loads

- low MERs, low tracking errors

- follows the "right" index (hummmmm....)

- if buying in a mutual funds account, make sure the chosen provider offers all the funds you want

- see Recommended Funds and Bylo's list for some ideas of what's available --Quebec 21:36, 22 January 2015 (MST)

"At the end of the day, all of the above is why I'm discussing this on the Talk page rather than just editing. Hope this helps.". It certainly does, thanks for sharing your thoughts, and some history of finiki!

About the "how to" section, there are things to know about choosing index mutual funds specifically (as opposed to, say, ETFs), so I think that "how to" or "considerations when" sections are needed in 3 places: "indexing" (with the generalities applicable to both index funds and ETFs), "ETFs" (specific) and "index funds" (specific). I went ahead and filled the latter, linking specific subsections in the "indexing" page, such as "tracking error" and so on.--Quebec 18:18, 23 January 2015 (MST)

Index mutual funds

I think this article should focus on index mutual funds, as opposed to topics such as ETFs, discussion of market value weighted indices vs fundamental based indexes, etc. Such topics can be covered in other articles. --Quebec 06:14, 23 January 2015 (MST)

I agree. I took a first cut at moving some content around to re-focus the article. More can probably be done, so carry on. The one challenge is index fund is a bit of a generic name, or maybe category might be a better term, to cover both mutual funds and exchange-traded funds. I think the article makes an attempt to clarify this, but maybe it is failing to do so. --Peculiar Investor 07:14, 23 January 2015 (MST)

The article is now much clearer, IMO. In my mind, "index fund" always means "index mutual fund". ETFs are something different, since they trade on stock exchages. They're funds, and they follow an index, but I don't call them "index funds". Maybe that's just me. Anyway my point is that there should be two separate pages about products: (1) index (mutual) funds, and (2) ETFs, and this is what we have now, so it's all good. --Quebec 16:47, 23 January 2015 (MST)